OSDev.org

how hard can it be? it's imo far from just the gui that needs to be redone/thrown out. concepts like downloading a program in binary form instead of as source, getting rid of dependency hell, config file hell, and well - lots of other stuff i don't even know that much about because i gave up on linux in like -99 or so and have only tried it 2-3 times after that, equally disappointed and frustrated each time. mainly because it takes me 3-4 google hours to get the most basic tasks done. last time i set up a basic http server with php and mysql it took me like 8 hours. xampp on windows took < 10 minutes first try. the learning curve is just to high for me to bother with it at all, should have learned it earlier instead when free time was plentiful. it's not like you can ease in to it, and discover things as you go. </end of *nix hate rant>

bubach wrote:how hard can it be? it's imo far from just the gui that needs to be redone/thrown out. concepts like downloading a program in binary form instead of as source,

I'd say 99% of the native Linux software on my system (Ubuntu 10.04) is in binary form only. Even most of the programs that I didn't get directly through the Ubuntu repositories are binary-only. Every once in a while you'll run across a really cool looking software project that is only available for Linux as source, but generally not for anything really critical.

What I dislike about my current OS (Windows 7 but it's still my favourite overall):

- Bootup times - how hard is it to copy the kernel, drivers, desktop to memory and start executing?

- Shut down times - how hard is it to flush caches to the disk and turn off?

- "Preparing to copy..." for 30 minutes - What is it doing? Just start the copying already.

- Every program thinks it has a right to add its own background service that runs at start up:
1. Google Updater - why not check for updates when I launch Google Chrome instead
2. Adobe Updater - likewise
3. Acrobat Reader cache - I'd rather wait an extra 2 seconds for Acrobat Reader to open a PDF than have it always running
4. Autodesk License - why does this need to be running without any Autodesk programs open?
5. Skype - this is useful because I use it a lot, HOWEVER I should explicitly choose if I want it to start at bootup - don't assume this is what I want. I have often installed IM programs for specific meetings and I only want it to open when I launch it, not every time I turn my computer on.

- Windows Live Messenger 2011 removed nicknames (I don't want my full name always exposed) and Ink Support (I can't send handwritten messages using my tablet PC or quick technical diagrams any more). Still using the old version.

- 64-bit and 32-bit world is divided and cant share plugins or extensions (Office, Oracle, Autodesk, Adobe, etc).

MessiahAndrw wrote:What I dislike about my current OS (Windows 7 but it's still my favourite overall):

- Bootup times - how hard is it to copy the kernel, drivers, desktop to memory and start executing?

What took long is finding configuration files (no FHS for Win, and for compatibility there're several posiibilities), parsing it (which involves loading another dlls), starting 3rd party crap etc. etc.

- Shut down times - how hard is it to flush caches to the disk and turn off?

It could take long if you don't know what's going on and you have to introduce timeout for every operations...

- "Preparing to copy..." for 30 minutes - What is it doing? Just start the copying already.

Well, that's something you cannot change. In order to display progress bar properly, you have to know the amount of data to be copied. For that you have to descent into the directory and sum all file sizes. (That's "preparing to copy").

- Every program thinks it has a right to add its own background service that runs at start up:

Yep, that's really annoying. Most of these can be avoided if you have a central package management with automatic version checking. Interesting how fluently in MacOSx it is (every app checks for new version on startup, or periodically if it's running, but no background updaters, strict path for apps etc.) despite of the fact it does not have centralized package management.
The worst of this is Android. On boot it executes every sh*t "just in case" (for example camera, galery, google spy apps etc.). That leads to terrible boot times and always low on resources. I usually kill unwanted apps regurarly on my mobile and suprisingly the battery lasts for 6 days, not couple of hours.

- 64-bit and 32-bit world is divided and cant share plugins or extensions (Office, Oracle, Autodesk, Adobe, etc).

I think it's a good thing. It was time for a fresh start to drop out all the legacy crap. Unfortunatelly they don't take advantage of this, most company just compiles it's source with 64 bit target, that's all. That means they still suffer from the same design desicions that had to make because of limitation on 32 bit.

Over time, I've used AmigaOS, Windows (98SE, 2k, XP), FreeBSD, Gentoo Linux, and Linux Mint.

And one of the reasons that I don't use Windows anymore if I can help it is the lack of a centralized software repository (as compared to Aminet, BSD ports, Gentoo Portage, and apt-get repos). The number of times when I had to manually create a list of the software installed on my office PC (!!) I cannot count on my fingers.

As a Linux user, the thing I hate about my current OS is the inconsistency in user interface. That starts with very simple things on the command line (-h? --help? -v? --version?), touches things like .deb vs. .rpm vs. ./configure && make install, and doesn't end at stuff like the Gnome 3 update ( ). Masses might be able to program, but they sure can't design to save their lives.

Another thing I hate in Linux is the attitude of the "community". Removing project management from the Kate editor because no-one could be bothered to maintain it. Breaking things for the end user with no prior warning and no "sorry" afterwards. (madwifi, the dropping of XFree86, and the conversion to modular X11 spring to my mind.) And if you point this out as deficiencies in user experience, you get flamed no small amount because "it's the way we do things here".

My dislike with the GPL camp I expressed often enough.

Oh, and by the way, as far as package management is concerned, apt sucks big time (at least when compared to Gentoo Portage in this regard), since apt cannot give me a list of the software titles I installed. It can tell me what packages are installed, but it cannot distinguish between things I wanted, and things that merely got installed as a dependency. SUCKS.

turdus wrote:The worst of this is Android. On boot it executes every sh*t "just in case" (for example camera, galery, google spy apps etc.). That leads to terrible boot times and always low on resources.

Exactly. And they decided by definition your application cannot exit() without ugly hack, even that you, as the application developer, know that upon next "start" it need fresh initializations.

They try to avoid exit() and rely on swap system, to shorten application switching time, yet the swap system is not perfect and make the system slow.
They try to pre-load application to shorten application start up time, yet they have stupid "chooser" to pre-load junk that rarely used.

bluemoon wrote:

turdus wrote:The worst of this is Android. On boot it executes every sh*t "just in case" (for example camera, galery, google spy apps etc.). That leads to terrible boot times and always low on resources.

Exactly. And they decided by definition your application cannot exit() without ugly hack, even that you, as the application developer, know that upon next "start" it need fresh initializations.

They try to avoid exit() and rely on swap system, to shorten application switching time, yet the swap system is not perfect and make the system slow.
They try to pre-load application to shorten application start up time, yet they have stupid "chooser" to pre-load junk that rarely used.

I don't like it when apps I've never launched are still running in the background and over the long term start to use up resources. I'm using CyanogenMod 9 with a custom modification that when I hold the menu key to show the list of recent programs, and slide the program off the list, it kills the process.

MessiahAndrw wrote:

bluemoon wrote:

turdus wrote:The worst of this is Android. On boot it executes every sh*t "just in case" (for example camera, galery, google spy apps etc.). That leads to terrible boot times and always low on resources.

Exactly. And they decided by definition your application cannot exit() without ugly hack, even that you, as the application developer, know that upon next "start" it need fresh initializations.

They try to avoid exit() and rely on swap system, to shorten application switching time, yet the swap system is not perfect and make the system slow.
They try to pre-load application to shorten application start up time, yet they have stupid "chooser" to pre-load junk that rarely used.

I don't like it when apps I've never launched are still running in the background and over the long term start to use up resources. I'm using CyanogenMod 9 with a custom modification that when I hold the menu key to show the list of recent programs, and slide the program off the list, it kills the process.

In CM7 at least theres an option to be able to press and hold the back button, which will kill the foreground process.

That said, my phone has plenty of apps installed, and it is always fast, never crashes and has a battery life of a couple days...

-JL

Yep, I also use CM, and I can kill processes. The problem is, time after time they're started again. One notorious is ROM Manager, that wants to run all the time, but only needed for firmware updates...

I'm currently using both Windows 7 and Ubuntu on the same desktop.
Windows is quite ok!
I hate Ubuntu coz I can't play many games on it

I use both windows(7) and linux(ubuntu). I dont like the fact that windows catches a lot of virus. Also, the fact that there are a limited number of games for linux.

I don't "hate" anything on OSes I have currently installed on my PC. I have dual boot setup - Linux Mint 12 KDE and Windows 7. Linux is for development and plain web surfing, Windows is for gaming and running MS Office suite, which is far superior to any of OpenOffices. The only think I can't say I like is time it takes Windows to get to usable desktop from clicking "login" - but that's not that important, because I do clean boot rarely, most time it's just hibernated and boots to usable environment very quickly.

After two days of defragmenting my 40Gb NTFS volume i've finally remembered that i hate that Windows lacks linux-style of managing FS blocks (afaik, linux FS drivers use strategies to avoid fragmentation + reorders blocks to eliminate fragmentation while idle/while file operations).

Is it possible to hate an operating system because there is no games made for it?

That's like hating goldfish because you can't put a saddle on them.

The fact that over 1 gig of my 2 gigs is system cache, and the vast amount of useless processes take half the CPU time. (XP pro SP3)